Pain guide · Shoulder pain

Shoulder pain when doing face pulls: the rotator cuff, pulley height, elbows, neck and what helps

Shoulder pain when you do face pulls usually comes from the rotator cuff, the commonest source of shoulder pain, or from the upper trapezius and neck taking over, and it is usually brought on by a load that is too heavy, a pulley that is too high, a pull that goes too far back, or a finish with the hands turned in. Where it hurts is the best clue: a pinch at the front or outside of the shoulder as the rope reaches your face points to the rotator cuff, a tender groove at the front to the biceps tendon, the top of the shoulder into the neck to the trapezius, and pain or tingling down the arm to a nerve in the neck. A lighter load, a lower pulley, a shorter pull and a turned-out finish usually help, and face pulls are a good exercise once the shoulder settles, though no trial has tested them on their own.

This guide starts with the signs that need help, from accident and emergency (A&E) for a shoulder that looks out of place after a fall, and a 999 call for shoulder or arm pain with chest pain, to a same-day check through the National Health Service's 111 line (NHS 111) or a general practitioner (GP) for sudden weakness lifting your arm, a hot, swollen shoulder, or numbness or weakness spreading down the arm. It then maps the causes by where it hurts, explains what the studies of arm position, the trapezius, exercise and surgery show, and don't, shows how to change your face pull today, and gives a three-stage plan with a 3D demo of every move, from band work back to your usual face pulls.

When to get help first

Exercise is for pain that has been checked or is clearly mild and settling.

Get urgent medical help if

  • Call 999 or go to A&E: after a fall or injury, your shoulder looks out of place or has changed shape, you cannot move your arm, or your shoulder is painful, bruised or swollen. Do not drive yourself, and do not try to put it back in yourself.
  • Call 999: shoulder or arm pain with chest pain that feels tight or squeezing, or chest pain that spreads to your arms, neck or jaw, especially with shortness of breath, sweating or feeling sick. It could be a heart attack.
  • Get help from NHS 111: pain or tightness in your chest, neck, shoulders, jaw or arms that comes and goes, often brought on by exercise, stress, emotion or cold and easing after a few minutes' rest. It can be angina, a sign of a heart problem. If you've been diagnosed with angina, get help from NHS 111 too if it feels worse than before, is happening more often, lasts longer or happens when you're resting.
  • Call 999: you suddenly can't fully lift both arms and keep them there, because of weakness or numbness in one arm, especially if one side of your face droops or you slur your words or sound confused. It could be a stroke. Call even if the signs have stopped.
  • Call 999 or go to A&E: new problems walking, loss of bladder or bowel control, or a sudden loss of coordination, such as difficulty doing up buttons. These can be signs of pressure on the spinal cord.
  • Call 999 or go to A&E: a headache that came on suddenly and is extremely painful; numbness or weakness in the face or body; a drooping face, or being unable to lift both arms and keep them up; difficulty speaking, swallowing, balancing, walking or remembering; double vision or loss of vision; drowsiness or confusion. A torn neck artery often starts with headache and neck pain, sometimes with dizziness or tingling, so head or neck pain unlike any you have had before needs checking.
  • Same day (GP or NHS 111): the shoulder or arm is hot, swollen or red, or you have a high temperature (although not everyone has one) or feel unwell. A joint infection needs same-day care.
  • Same day (GP or NHS 111): sudden or very bad shoulder pain; you cannot move your arm; the arm or shoulder is badly swollen or has changed shape; pins and needles that do not go away; no feeling in the arm; the arm is hot or cold to the touch; pain that started after an injury such as a fall; or severe pain in both shoulders.
  • Same day (GP or NHS 111): sudden weakness lifting the arm after an injury or fall. A rotator cuff tear caused by an injury needs urgent referral to a shoulder specialist. After a dislocation in anyone over 40, the rotator cuff should be checked: about 40% have a tear.
  • Same day (GP or NHS 111): a sudden pop or snap with pain at the shoulder or upper arm during a lift, with or without a bulge low in the upper arm. It's usually a torn long head of the biceps. Most need no operation, but the rotator cuff can tear at the same time.
  • Same day (urgent GP appointment or NHS 111): severe neck pain that starts suddenly or gets worse quickly; heaviness or weakness in the arms or legs; pins and needles in an arm along with neck or arm pain; or pain between the shoulder blades.
  • Same day: clumsiness in your hands, or numbness, pins and needles or weakness in one or both arms, that is getting worse; problems with balance or walking since the neck pain started; or neck pain with a severe headache.
  • Arm weakness or numbness that keeps getting worse, severe pain that painkillers and rest do not touch, or an unexplained fever.

See a doctor or physiotherapist if

  • Pain that is getting worse or has not improved after 2 weeks of looking after it yourself, or it is very hard to move your arm. In many areas you can refer yourself to physiotherapy.
  • Not improving after a good 3 months of exercise, or the arm is clearly weak: ask for a specialist opinion.
  • Pain on top of the shoulder with no injury that hasn't eased after 6 to 12 weeks of changing your training: ask a GP or physiotherapist for an assessment.
  • Painful clicking or snapping at the front of the shoulder, or a feeling of something slipping there. The tendon can slip out of its groove, usually alongside a rotator cuff tear, so ask for an assessment.
  • Your shoulder has partly or fully come out of joint, or you worry it might.
  • Pins and needles or a cold arm alongside neck pain, or a new loss of strength or feeling in the arm that you cannot explain (a possible nerve problem).
  • No improvement after 6 weeks of exercise, or arm symptoms still there beyond 6 to 12 weeks.
  • Nerve symptoms and trouble with daily life more than 3 months after an injury: a guideline advises referral for medical investigation.
  • Severe pain that is constant or disturbs your sleep, a fever or unexplained weight loss, or a history of cancer, inflammatory arthritis, tuberculosis (TB), a weakened immune system, neck surgery or a violent injury. Serious causes are very rare, but these need checking.
  • A past history of cancer, an unexplained lump or swelling, weight loss, or pain that is constant and does not ease when you change position.
  • You smoke or used to, and have shoulder pain with a cough that will not go away, breathlessness or weight loss. See a GP if you've had a cough for longer than 3 weeks; if you've coughed up blood, ask for an urgent GP appointment or get help from NHS 111.
  • See a GP if you have pain and stiffness for more than a week, especially if you're over 50, it's in both shoulders (often the neck and hips too) and the stiffness lasts longer than 45 minutes in the morning. It can be polymyalgia rheumatica.
  • See a GP for bone pain or tenderness, particularly if it's worse at night, a lump or swelling, or looking more pale than usual, getting ill a lot or swollen glands. NICE (the National Institute for Health and Care Excellence) asks GPs to arrange a very urgent blood test for persistent or unexplained bone pain in a child, and to consider a very urgent X-ray for unexplained bone swelling or pain.

Where does it hurt?

Location narrows the likely causes; it does not diagnose.

The outside or front of the shoulder and upper arm, a pinch or ache as the elbows reach shoulder height or the rope reaches your face, sometimes at night

Rotator cuff related pain, often called impingement: by far the commonest kind.

Read: Shoulder impingement (rotator cuff pain) →
The top of the shoulder into the side of the neck, building through the set, worse when you shrug or pull high

Usually the upper trapezius and neck muscles taking over. Our neck pain in rows guide covers it.

Read: Neck pain in rows →
A tender groove at the front, worse at the end of the pull or reaching back

The long head of the biceps tendon, usually alongside the rotator cuff.

Read: Biceps tendinitis (shoulder) →
Deep at the front or back, with clicking, catching or a feeling of slipping when the hands go far back

A loose shoulder or the labrum, the rim of cartilage round the socket: get it assessed.

Read: SLAP tear →
One spot on top, at the end of the collarbone

The acromioclavicular (AC) joint.

Read: AC joint injury and pain →
An even ache at the back of both shoulders a day or two after a new or harder session, easing day by day

Usually muscle soreness.

Read: Shoulder pain after a workout →
Pain at the back of the shoulder that stays in the joint, or catches

Our back of the shoulder guide maps the causes.

Read: Back of shoulder pain →
Sudden weakness lifting the arm after a jerking heavy rep, sometimes with a snap

A possible rotator cuff tear: get it checked the same day, as the warning signs say.

Read: Rotator cuff tear →
From the neck down the arm, with pins and needles, numbness or weakness

A trapped nerve in the neck.

Read: Pinched nerve in the neck →
The inside or outside of the elbow

Our elbow pain when rowing guide covers pulling and the elbow.

Read: Elbow pain in rows →
The same shoulder pain in rows to the waist, upright rows or raises

Our rows, upright row and lateral raise guides cover those lifts.

Read: Shoulder pain in rows →
Shoulder or arm pain with chest pain, breathlessness or sweating

Possibly the heart: call 999, as the warning signs say.

Understand it

What a face pull asks of the shoulder, and what no study has measuredEmerging evidence

A face pull is a high row with an outward turn: a rope at about eye height, the elbows pulled back high and wide, finishing with the hands beside the ears, as our face pull guide teaches it. The National Academy of Sports Medicine (NASM) sets the rope at about eye height; the American Council on Exercise's (ACE's) similar high row puts the pulley at about shoulder height, with the palms down.

No study has recorded muscle activity (electromyography, or EMG) in the face pull itself. The one study we found was a computer model in 10 healthy men, which estimated that the standing face pull and the bent-over dumbbell raise loaded the rear deltoid about equally, and the summary of a review of 33 deltoid muscle activity studies doesn't mention it. What the face pull works is inferred from similar moves: lying face down and raising the arms out to the side with the hands turned out drove the rear deltoid to 88% of its maximum and the supraspinatus to 82%, and a horizontal pull with an outward turn worked the middle trapezius hardest of 10 exercises. So the map on this page is our reading of lab studies, the conditions themselves and coaching.

Sources 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6

How common it is, and who gets itEmerging evidence

No study counts shoulder pain from face pulls. Across resistance training, up to 36% of recorded injuries are at the shoulder, mostly from surveys, and among upper limb weightlifting injuries in US emergency departments, the shoulder was the commonest site (33.8%), with pulling movements the second commonest cause. NHS inform calls subacromial pain, the pain of the rotator cuff under the bony roof of the shoulder, the most common reason for shoulder pain.

Who gets it, in our reading: lifters who add face pulls heavy or in high volume because they are sold as shoulder protection, people with a shoulder already sore from pressing, people who pull the rope to the forehead or past the ears with the elbows flaring above the hands, and people whose neck and upper trapezius take over.

Sources 7, 8, 9

Pulley height, the elbows and the finishMixed evidence

The space under the acromion (the bony roof of the shoulder) narrows as the arm rises: from about 7.0 mm at 30 degrees to 3.9 mm at 120 degrees in a magnetic resonance imaging (MRI) study. Turning the hand changes where the tendon meets the roof: in 13 people with no shoulder problem, the arm at shoulder height fully turned in pressed the tendon against the roof with a force of about 21 newtons, against 3 or less with the arm neutral or turned out, and holding 4 kg, the space at shoulder height was larger turned out than with the hand neutral or at the top of an upright row in 25 young men. That suggests the face pull's turned-out finish is kinder than a palms-down pull.

But the evidence on turning out is mixed: in the MRI study the gap at 90 degrees was narrower turned out than turned in, and a review says how high the arm goes has consistently mattered, while the effect of rotation is less clear. In a study of 46 men who trained with weights and 31 who didn't, lateral raises and upright rows above 90 degrees went with impingement signs, and training the outward rotators went with fewer, a snapshot that can't show cause. Our reading: keep the elbows at or below shoulder height, finish turned out with the hands beside or above the elbows, and don't let a heavy pull turn into an upright row with the hands turned in.

Sources 10, 11, 12, 13, 14

The hands pulled far back, and the front of the shoulderEmerging evidence

Pulling the rope far past the ears takes the arm up and back into the "high-five" position: in a study of 123 men who trained with weights and 36 who didn't, exercises that need it, such as behind-the-neck pull-downs and presses, went with clinical signs of a loose shoulder at the front. Deep pain with clicking or catching in that position can come from the labrum and biceps anchor in people who already have that tear.

A tender groove at the front points to the biceps tendon, where a review found little evidence on non-surgical care. One spot on top at the end of the collarbone points to the AC joint; wear of the collarbone's end most often affects weightlifters, with bench pressing and flies more than pulls.

Sources 15, 16, 17, 18

The neck and the top of the shoulderMixed evidence

An ache from the top of the shoulder into the neck, with the shoulders creeping up as the set goes on, is usually the upper trapezius working hard. In a review of 15 muscle activity studies, standing exercises worked the upper trapezius more, especially with the arm between 60 and 120 degrees, and it was least active lying face down, on the side or on the back. Whether a lower pulley spares the neck is mixed: in 35 people, pulling back with the arms at 90 degrees raised the upper trapezius against the lower more than at 45 or 120 degrees, but in 15 men pulling a band, the upper trapezius was highest with the arms lowest. People with impingement showed more upper trapezius activity in a review, an association rather than a cause.

Pain, pins and needles or numbness from the neck down the arm is different: a trapped nerve in the neck, which NHS inform says can cause pain, numbness, tingling or weakness in the arm or hand. NHS inform also notes that shoulder problems are occasionally due to the neck.

Sources 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25

When a scan or test helpsStrong evidence

Rotator cuff pain is diagnosed by examination. A UK pathway says ultrasound or MRI of the cuff is rarely needed in primary care, and that a cuff tear from an injury needs urgent referral.

Scans of shoulders that don't hurt show a lot: 96% of 51 men aged 40 to 70 without symptoms had something on an ultrasound; across 6,112 shoulders, cuff changes rose from 9.7% at 20 or younger to 62% at 80 or older; in 96 people without symptoms MRI showed tears in 34%, but none of the 25 aged 19 to 39 had a full-thickness tear; and in one village, tears without symptoms were twice as common as tears with them. In 20 elite overhead athletes, 40% of throwing shoulders had tear findings, and none had symptoms 5 years later. A scan matters after an injury with sudden weakness, with warning signs, or when pain hasn't settled after about 3 months of good exercise care.

Sources 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31

How it usually goesEmerging evidence

No study follows shoulder pain from face pulls. The NHS says it can take 6 months or longer to recover from shoulder pain; NHS inform says many shoulder problems begin to settle within 6 weeks; and an NHS trust leaflet says rotator cuff related pain settles in about 6 months in about half of people on its own. A trapped nerve in the neck usually starts to improve within 12 weeks, and most people with one recover. No one can promise a date.

Sources 32, 25, 33, 24, 34

What helps, and how strong the evidence is

Exercise is the first treatment for rotator cuff painStrong evidence

An umbrella review made a strong recommendation for exercise as the first treatment for pain under the bony roof of the shoulder. In 102 people with long-standing impingement on a surgical waiting list, 12 weeks of specific rotator cuff and shoulder-blade exercises gave a successful result in 69% against 24% with general exercises, and only 20% chose surgery against 63%.

In 708 adults with rotator cuff disorders, one advice session with a physiotherapist and a home programme did as well as up to six sessions of progressive exercise, and one self-managed loaded exercise did as well as usual physiotherapy in 86 people. A critical review warns that the effects are modest and the evidence low in quality. None of these trials tested face pulls, and none was of face-pull pain: the evidence is borrowed from rotator cuff pain in general.

Sources 35, 36, 37, 38, 39

Turning out at the finish and a lower pulley: lab readings, not tested for painMixed evidence

No trial has tested any change to the face pull for shoulder pain. A turned-out finish measured little squeeze under the bony roof in small lab studies of young pain-free people, but an MRI study and a review make the effect of rotation less certain than the effect of how high the arm goes. A lower pulley or lower elbows sparing the neck is mixed too: one study of 35 people found more upper trapezius work with the arms at 90 degrees, and another of 15 men found the most with the arms lowest. So the page's settings are our reading: use the height and finish that pass the pain rule.

Sources 11, 12, 10, 13, 20, 21

Swaps that spare the neck and the front of the shoulderEmerging evidence

In 10 men, band pull-aparts with the palms up worked the infraspinatus and lower trapezius more and the upper trapezius less than palms down. On a reverse fly machine, a neutral grip worked the rear deltoid and infraspinatus more than a palms-down grip, and a one-arm row favoured the middle over the upper trapezius. Lying on your side to turn the arm out gave the highest infraspinatus activity, with a quiet upper trapezius. These are muscle activity studies in people without pain, so they show what a swap works, not that it eases pain.

Sources 40, 41, 42, 5, 22, 19

Shoulder-blade exercise and posture: a modest extraMixed evidence

Across 8 trials (387 people), shoulder-blade stabilising exercise eased pain by less than 1 point out of 10 and improved function, and shoulder-blade-focused programmes beat general ones up to 6 weeks but not at 3 months. A rounded upper back wasn't different between people with and without shoulder pain, and studies haven't linked muscle strength with where the shoulder blades sit at rest, so face pulls aren't a posture fix.

In elite handball players, a warm-up programme including outward rotation and shoulder-blade strength cut shoulder problems over a season from 23% to 17%, a throwing population rather than lifters.

Sources 43, 44, 45, 46, 47

Injections and surgeryStrong evidence

A steroid injection helped in the short term but not over 12 months in the trial of 708 adults. Surgery to shave bone and make more room under the acromion did no better than placebo surgery at 6 months, and no better than placebo surgery or exercise over 10 years in a second trial.

For non-injury cuff tears in people over 55, physiotherapy alone did as well as surgery at a year; for small and medium tears, repair did better at 10 years in one trial, which is why sudden weakness after an injury needs a prompt assessment.

Sources 37, 48, 49, 50, 51

How much pain is OK while you exercise?

Up to about 5 out of 10, back to where it was by your next sessionEmerging evidence

This guide uses the shoulder hub's rule, as our lateral raise, rows and upright row guides do. During shoulder strengthening, pain up to about 5 out of 10 is acceptable, and a little is expected. By your next session it should be back to where it was before. If it isn't, use a lighter band or weight or a smaller range next time, not nothing. This is how the Holmgren trial set each person's load: pain was not allowed above 5 out of 10 during the exercises, and any increase had to settle back to the starting level before the next session; otherwise the load came down. If pain climbs week on week, or a warning sign appears, stop and get it checked.

Stop and get checked if you get a sharp pain with a sudden loss of strength: a small tear can get bigger. NHS inform's shoulder exercises use the same limit of 0 to 5 out of 10, an NHS trust says you can push into a tolerable amount of pain if it calms down by that evening, and in 7 trials, 3 of them in shoulder pain, exercise into some pain gave a small short-term benefit over pain-free exercise.

For face pulls (our suggestion, built on the same rules): judge each set by its last reps and the shoulder by your next session. Choose the swap or the face pull, the pulley height, the range, the load and the reps where the last reps stay at 5 out of 10 or less and the shoulder is back to its usual level by the next session; if it isn't, go back a step, not to nothing. If the neck takes over, the set ends when the shoulders start creeping up. If pain, pins and needles or numbness spread down the arm, the arm sets the limit: stop the movement that spreads them and follow our trapped nerve in the neck guide. Sudden weakness, a pop or a bulge in the arm, a feeling of slipping or a dead arm, and chest pain aren't pain-rule questions: see the warning signs.

Sources 36, 52, 33, 53

The exercise plan: 3 stages

Start at the first stage. Each move opens a full guide with a 3D demo.

Stage 1

Keep pulling: low, light and turned out

About weeks 0 to 2: keep the back of the shoulder and the rotator cuff working with the arm low, from day one, with no face pulls if they hurt and no upright rows; settle the neck if it's sore. Cuff work daily, rows and pull-aparts 2 or 3 times a week. With a diagnosed condition (a rotator cuff tear, a loose shoulder or dislocation, biceps tendon pain, an AC joint problem, a trapped nerve in the neck), that guide's plan comes first; after surgery, the surgical team's plan does.

Standing band external rotation demonstrated on the 3D figure3D demoStanding band external rotationBeginner · A band + An anchor point

3 sets of 15, light band, elbow at your side, twice a day, within the pain rule · The sets, repetitions and frequency of the trial of 102 people's cuff exercises, as our lateral raise and rows guides use them; the exercise is our choice. If 15 hurts, start with NHS inform's 2 to 3 at a time

Easier: Stick-assisted external rotation (lying) · Harder: Side-lying external rotation

Band row demonstrated on the 3D figure3D demoBand rowBeginner · A band + An anchor point

3 sets of 10 to 15, stopping 2 to 3 reps short of failure, with 60 to 90 seconds' rest: an editorial starting point. Training with elastic bands improves strength and muscle size compared with no training; no trial of this exact exercise was reviewed. · The move page's dose. Elbows low and close, pulling to your waist, without shrugging, as its steps say

Harder: Supported single-arm dumbbell row

Band pull-apart demonstrated on the 3D figure3D demoBand pull-apartIntermediate · A band

2 to 3 sets of 12 to 15, a light band at chest height, palms up · Our rounded shoulders guide's dose, as our face pull guide gives it (editorial); palms up from a muscle activity study

Easier: Prone Y-T-W raises · Harder: Tuck back lever

Side-lying external rotation demonstrated on the 3D figure3D demoSide-lying external rotationBeginner · A dumbbell

2 to 3 sets of 10 to 15 each side, a light dumbbell or none, lowering over about 3 s · Editorial; lying on your side gave the highest infraspinatus activity with a quiet upper trapezius

Easier: Standing band external rotation · Harder: Cuban rotation

Lying chin tuck demonstrated on the 3D figure3D demoLying chin tuckBeginner · No equipment

Only if the neck is sore: 5 to 10 gentle holds of up to 10 s, once or twice a day · As in our rows and shrug neck guides (editorial)

Harder: Chin tuck

Move on when: Daily life and these moves pass the pain rule for a week, and lifting your arm to shoulder height with the hand turned out is comfortable (editorial, as in our lateral raise guide).

Follow along: a timer, a cue and the next move, one step at a time.
Stage 2

Build the back of the shoulder lying down, then a low face pull

About weeks 2 to 6: stronger outward rotators, rear deltoids and middle and lower trapezius with the trunk supported, then the face pull pattern back from a low pulley, seated and light. 3 to 5 days a week for the cuff, 2 or 3 for the rest.

Side-lying external rotation demonstrated on the 3D figure3D demoSide-lying external rotationBeginner · A dumbbell

3 sets of 15, once a day, lowering over about 3 s · The sets and repetitions of the trial of 102 people, as our impingement and lateral raise guides use them

Easier: Standing band external rotation · Harder: Cuban rotation

Flat-bench reverse fly demonstrated on the 3D figure3D demoFlat-bench reverse flyBeginner · A dumbbell + A bench or box

2 to 3 sets of 10 to 15, stopping with 2 or 3 reps in reserve (our editorial starting point). · The move page's dose. Chest on the bench keeps the upper trapezius quieter

Easier: Prone Y-T-W raises · Harder: Bent-over reverse fly

Prone Y-T-W raises demonstrated on the 3D figure3D demoProne Y-T-W raisesBeginner · No equipment

2 rounds of 8 of each shape, light · As in our rows guide (editorial). Keep the neck long, as the move page says

Easier: Wall angel · Harder: Bent-over reverse fly

Chest-supported dumbbell row demonstrated on the 3D figure3D demoChest-supported dumbbell rowBeginner · A dumbbell + A bench or box

3 sets of 6 to 8, holding 2 s at the top, palms facing in · An NHS trust leaflet's dumbbell row dose, as our rows guide uses it

Harder: Supported single-arm dumbbell row

Seated rope row to the neck demonstrated on the 3D figure3D demoSeated rope row to the neckBeginner · A cable machine

2 to 3 sets of 10 to 15, stopping with 2 or 3 reps in reserve (our editorial starting point). · The move page's dose. A seated face pull from a low pulley, light, the elbows no higher than the shoulders, finishing turned out

Easier: Seated rope high row · Harder: Incline bench pull (45-degree incline row)

Move on when: 3 sets of 12 to 15 low-pulley rows to the neck pass the pain rule, with the shoulder back to its usual level by the next session, for a week (editorial).

Follow along: a timer, a cue and the next move, one step at a time.
Stage 3

Back to face pulls, then your usual pulling

From about week 6, often later: the standing face pull back with the rope at chest to eye height, light first, then your usual load, one change at a time by the written steps below, with the cuff and shoulder-blade work kept twice a week. No study has tested a return to face pulls after shoulder pain, so the order is editorial.

Face pull demonstrated on the 3D figure3D demoFace pullIntermediate · A band

3 sets of 12 to 20, stopping 0 to 2 reps short of failure, with 60 seconds' rest; the rope at chest height first, then eye height, light, adding weight only when 20 clean reps are easy · Our face pull guide's dose and progression (editorial, as in our workouts)

Easier: Prone Y-T-W raises · Harder: Tuck back lever

Incline reverse fly with external rotation demonstrated on the 3D figure3D demoIncline reverse fly with external rotationIntermediate · A dumbbell + A bench or box

3 sets of 10 · As in our impingement guide (editorial): the face pull's finish lying down, close to the position that drove the rear deltoid to 88% of its maximum

Easier: Prone Y-T-W raises · Harder: Barbell rear-delt row

Cable external rotation demonstrated on the 3D figure3D demoCable external rotationBeginner · A cable machine

2 to 3 sets of 10 to 15, twice a week, kept going · As in our rows guide (editorial). Outward rotator training went with fewer impingement signs in weight trainers, an association

Harder: Side-lying external rotation

Bent-over reverse fly demonstrated on the 3D figure3D demoBent-over reverse flyIntermediate · A dumbbell

3 sets of 12 to 15 · Our shoulder workout's dose (editorial), as our lateral raise guide uses it

Easier: Prone Y-T-W raises · Harder: Barbell rear-delt row

Seated cable row demonstrated on the 3D figure3D demoSeated cable rowBeginner · A cable machine

3 sets of 8 to 12, stopping 2 or 3 reps short of failure, a narrow palms-facing handle, elbows close, to the lower ribs · Our seated cable row guide's dose, as our rows guide uses it (editorial)

Harder: Supported single-arm dumbbell row

Move on when: Your usual pulling sessions pass the pain rule for 2 weeks. Keep two sessions a week of cuff and shoulder-blade work for the long term, and if a session flares it, go back a stage for a few days, not to nothing (editorial).

Follow along: a timer, a cue and the next move, one step at a time.

What to change for now

Your face pull for now (written steps)

Our 3D figure can't show the pulley height, the rope or your elbows' path. These steps come from lab studies, our face pull and shoulder guides, and coaching; where a step is our suggestion, it says so. No trial has tested a change to the face pull for shoulder pain.

  • 1. Lighter: NASM lists too much weight and shrugging among the common mistakes; if you swing, lean back or shrug, it's too heavy (our face pull guide). Halve the load for a week or two (editorial).
  • 2. A lower pulley: chest or shoulder height rather than above your head while it's sore, as ACE sets its high row, with the elbows level with or a little below your shoulders. Pulley height hasn't been tested for pain and the muscle studies are mixed, so use the height that passes the pain rule (our suggestion).
  • 3. A smaller range: stop with your hands beside your face or ears, and don't drive the elbows or hands far behind your head, the "high-five" position linked with a loose shoulder in lifters (our suggestion).
  • 4. Turn out at the finish: forearms turned up and the hands at or above the elbows, the position that measured little squeeze in small lab studies. A heavy, palms-down pull with the hands below the elbows behaves more like an upright row (our reading).
  • 5. Shoulders down, chin level: keep the neck long and the shoulders away from your ears. If your neck aches, swap to band pull-aparts for now, as our face pull guide suggests.
  • 6. Swaps while it settles: palms-up band pull-aparts, chest-supported rear-delt raises or reverse flys with a neutral grip, a one-arm row, or side-lying outward rotation.
  • 7. Fewer, not more: face pulls once or twice a week at the end of a session, not daily, while it settles; our face pull guide found no evidence for daily face pulls.
  • 8. Keep using the arm: the NHS advises against strenuous exercises you make up yourself and heavy gym equipment while the shoulder is sore, so keep the plan's light work and everyday use within the pain rule.

Sources 1, 2, 20, 21, 15, 11, 12, 40, 41, 32

Everyday life, the gym and sport (written steps)

Our suggestions unless a source is named. Keep using the arm below shoulder height for everyday jobs, and bring overhead reaching back as our lifting your arm guide describes. In the gym, keep pressing within the pain rule by our bench and overhead press guides, and put face pulls at the end of a pull or upper-body session once or twice a week (our face pull guide). Throwing and racquet sports come back by our throwing guide. At a desk, move your neck and shoulders through the day; a rounded upper back isn't a reliable cause of shoulder pain. Keep some cuff and shoulder-blade work going, twice a week (our suggestion); the trial of 102 people advised carrying on its home exercises.

Sources 45, 36

Positions to swap, and why

Habit or positionWhy it mattersInstead
Heavy face pulls with swinging, leaning back or shruggingNASM lists too much weight and shrugging as mistakes, and the upper trapezius takes over standing pulls.Lighter; band pull-aparts for now.Try: Band pull-apart
A pulley above your head, pulling to your foreheadIt takes the arm higher, and how high the arm goes is the main factor in the space under the bony roof (our reading).Chest or shoulder height; the seated rope row to the neck.Try: Seated rope row to the neck
Elbows flaring above the hands, palms down at the finishRaising the arm turned in caused the most squeeze in a lab study.Finish turned out, hands at or above the elbows.Try: Standing band external rotation
Driving the hands or elbows far behind the headThe "high-five" position went with signs of a loose shoulder in lifters.Stop with your hands beside your face.Try: Face pull
Shoulders creeping up to the ears, with a sore neckThe upper trapezius is doing the work.Lying versions.Try: Flat-bench reverse fly
Daily face pulls to fix a sore shoulderOur face pull guide found no evidence for daily face pulls, and a programme matters more than one exercise.Two or three sessions a week, with the cuff work.Try: Side-lying external rotation
Upright rows while it's soreUpright rows and raises above shoulder height went with impingement signs in lifters.Our upright row guide's plan; a row to the waist meanwhile.Try: Band row
Resting the arm completelyExercise is the first treatment for rotator cuff pain.The stage 1 moves.Try: Band row
Pulling through a pop, sudden weakness or a dead armIt can mean a torn tendon or a loose shoulder: see the warning signs.Stop and get it checked.
Pushing through pins and needles down the armThat is the nerve's rule, not the shoulder's.Our trapped nerve in the neck guide's plan.

Routines to follow

More moves for this area

Questions people ask

Why do face pulls hurt my shoulder?

Usually the weight is too heavy, the pulley too high, or the pull goes too far back or finishes with the hands turned in, which irritates a sore rotator cuff. Go lighter, lower the pulley to chest height, stop with your hands beside your face and turn out at the finish. Keep pain at 5 out of 10 or less and settled by your next session.

Why does the front of my shoulder hurt during face pulls?

Often the rotator cuff or the biceps tendon, especially if your hands go far behind your head. Shorten the pull and lighten the load. Clicking, catching or a feeling of slipping needs an assessment.

Why does my neck hurt doing face pulls?

The upper trapezius, from your neck to the tip of your shoulder, works hard in standing pulls. Keep your shoulders down, go lighter, or swap to lying rear-delt raises or palms-up band pull-aparts. Pins and needles or numbness down the arm point to a nerve and need checking.

Do face pulls help shoulder pain?

They can be part of a plan: rotator cuff and shoulder-blade exercises helped long-standing impingement in a trial. But no trial has tested face pulls on their own, and the effects of exercise are modest.

Are face pulls good for the rotator cuff?

They work the muscles that turn the arm out, and lifters who trained those muscles had fewer impingement signs, an association rather than proof. With a torn or very sore cuff, start with side-lying or band outward rotation and bring face pulls back later.

Can I do face pulls with shoulder impingement?

Usually yes, changed: lighter, the pulley at chest height, a shorter pull and a turned-out finish, within the pain rule. Our impingement guide brings face pulls in once the shoulder is building strength.

What height should the cable be for face pulls with a sore shoulder?

Chest or shoulder height while it's sore, then eye height once it passes the pain rule. No study has compared heights for pain, and the muscle studies disagree about the neck, so use the height that feels best.

Are band pull-aparts or face pulls better for a sore shoulder?

Palms-up band pull-aparts shifted work to the infraspinatus and lower trapezius and away from the upper trapezius, so they are a good swap while it settles. Both are fine once your shoulder passes the pain rule.

Why does the back of my shoulder ache after face pulls?

An even ache in the rear deltoids a day or two after a new or harder session is soreness, and it fades day by day. Pain in the joint, a catch or a clunk isn't: see our back of the shoulder guide.

Do I need a scan?

Not at first: rotator cuff pain is diagnosed by examination, and scans of shoulders that don't hurt often show tears. A scan matters after an injury with sudden weakness, or for pain that hasn't settled after about 3 months of good exercise care.

How long will it take?

No one can promise a date: many shoulder problems begin to settle within 6 weeks, but the NHS says recovery can take 6 months or longer. Many people keep doing a changed version throughout.

When should I see a doctor?

Go to A&E for a shoulder that looks out of place after a fall, call 999 for shoulder or arm pain with chest pain, and get a same-day check for sudden weakness lifting the arm, a hot, swollen shoulder with a high temperature, or numbness or weakness spreading down the arm. See a GP or physiotherapist if it's no better after 2 weeks. In the US, call 911 where this page says 999.

Related exercise guides

Other pain guides

Sources

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  2. ACE · High row with a rope (exercise library, American Council on Exercise)
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Exercise education, not a diagnosis or treatment plan. It is written from the guidelines and studies listed above; review by a clinician is pending. If your pain follows an injury, is severe, is getting worse, or comes with any warning sign listed on this page, get it assessed. Health disclaimer.